Wednesday, December 14, 2005
Wasting Tax Money on Prayer Lawsuits
Before the lawsuit, when Great Falls South Carolina held a town council meeting, it was always opened with a Christian prayer. When town resident Darla Kaye Wynne, herself a practicing Wiccan Priestess, suggested maybe the prayers should be more inclusive of other beliefs, her requests were rebuffed. Eventually, in light of the town’s stubborn refusal to modify their behavior, Wynne sued.
This is not rocket science, and the decisions handed down by Supreme Court after Supreme Court, have all sided against the idea of the government endorsing a specific religion, (and holding a targeted religious worship at a town meeting is certainly an endorsement). It is precisely because the majority of Americans are Christian that government entities must not discriminate against those who follow other faiths, not the other way around.
Great Falls SC has a total population of slightly more than 2100 citizens, not what one would consider a massive tax base, but the city leaders decided to fight Wynne’s suit rather than follow the American Constitution. And they lost, lost, lost, and finally lost again. Not only did these people lose in court and the tens of thousands of dollars it cost them in attorney fees, they also have been forced to pay Ms Wynne’s attorney fees as well. The taxpayers of Great Falls SC are out another $53,000.00 dollars and they had to negotiate a payment plan because they were out of funds.
This is money wasted by the city council that could have fed for a year 145 of the starving orphans pictured on late night TV, or it could have bought a pile of new textbooks for the local school, or maybe paid for an additional teacher. Instead, it’s just about enough money to buy an attorney a new Lexus or BMW, and that’s just the money they spent on Wynne’s attorney. Who knows how much they paid to their own legal buddies to argue the case.
Enough is enough! Americans are and should be free to practice their own personal religion free from government interference and compulsion. That’s what “freedom of religion” means. If you find it absolutely essential that you say a prayer before a meeting, knock yourself out. No one is trying to keep you from praying, just don’t do it as part of an official government function. It is not patriotic to oppose freedom; it is un-American to do so. Local governments, school boards, state governments, and federals, should all strive to follow the Constitution, not try to break it.
This is not rocket science, and the decisions handed down by Supreme Court after Supreme Court, have all sided against the idea of the government endorsing a specific religion, (and holding a targeted religious worship at a town meeting is certainly an endorsement). It is precisely because the majority of Americans are Christian that government entities must not discriminate against those who follow other faiths, not the other way around.
Great Falls SC has a total population of slightly more than 2100 citizens, not what one would consider a massive tax base, but the city leaders decided to fight Wynne’s suit rather than follow the American Constitution. And they lost, lost, lost, and finally lost again. Not only did these people lose in court and the tens of thousands of dollars it cost them in attorney fees, they also have been forced to pay Ms Wynne’s attorney fees as well. The taxpayers of Great Falls SC are out another $53,000.00 dollars and they had to negotiate a payment plan because they were out of funds.
This is money wasted by the city council that could have fed for a year 145 of the starving orphans pictured on late night TV, or it could have bought a pile of new textbooks for the local school, or maybe paid for an additional teacher. Instead, it’s just about enough money to buy an attorney a new Lexus or BMW, and that’s just the money they spent on Wynne’s attorney. Who knows how much they paid to their own legal buddies to argue the case.
Enough is enough! Americans are and should be free to practice their own personal religion free from government interference and compulsion. That’s what “freedom of religion” means. If you find it absolutely essential that you say a prayer before a meeting, knock yourself out. No one is trying to keep you from praying, just don’t do it as part of an official government function. It is not patriotic to oppose freedom; it is un-American to do so. Local governments, school boards, state governments, and federals, should all strive to follow the Constitution, not try to break it.
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dude,
that's so funny! Only because the money wouldn't have gone on anything worthwhile anyway, i mean even assuming it went on a teacher, what sort of teacher would be acceptible to these morons? Probably one who was prepared to teach 'creationism' as a 'theory'. Shame it didn't bankrupt the entire town i say!
We have a saying in the uk, "Only in America!" The accepted behaviour upon this utterance is to snigger and shake our heads. This is to prevent us from having to consider the planetary cost and worrying ramifications of a bunch of under and ill educated barbarians pillaging their way through everything civilisation has acheived, because if we did, we'd cry bitter tears of frustration, like a crack addict murderer's mother.
I don't follow any organised religion, but it's like Malcolm X said, "When the Bible mentions Soddom and Gomorrah, that's America!"
that's so funny! Only because the money wouldn't have gone on anything worthwhile anyway, i mean even assuming it went on a teacher, what sort of teacher would be acceptible to these morons? Probably one who was prepared to teach 'creationism' as a 'theory'. Shame it didn't bankrupt the entire town i say!
We have a saying in the uk, "Only in America!" The accepted behaviour upon this utterance is to snigger and shake our heads. This is to prevent us from having to consider the planetary cost and worrying ramifications of a bunch of under and ill educated barbarians pillaging their way through everything civilisation has acheived, because if we did, we'd cry bitter tears of frustration, like a crack addict murderer's mother.
I don't follow any organised religion, but it's like Malcolm X said, "When the Bible mentions Soddom and Gomorrah, that's America!"
Whoa Edjog! I think you're being just a little tough on us over here. One of the reasons for our "freedom of religion" was because of England's state controlled church. Thanks for the perspective though.
Mike G
Mike G
Thanks Dana, It would be nice to see local governments get out of debates beyond their ability or authority, and focus instead on their mandatory functions.
Mike G
Mike G
Of course you're right, Mike, about the origins of your Constitutional seperation of Church and State, just one thing amongst many which makes the document an inspiration to all sensible humans. The problem seems to be, like so much we hear coming out of the US, the complete hypochrisy of the stated aim when compared to the actual practice and in fairness, i don't believe i've been anywhere near hard enough.
It's a fact that the Church, in the UK, still is not disestablished, in fact we've recently had a law passed which makes it illegal to incite religious hatred per se, ostensibly to offer the same kind of protection available to all religions, this in the face of a campaign to simply repeal the Blasphemy laws, which previously protected only christianity. Being new law, it is yet to be seen how far the courts will allow satire to go, but many here see it as regressive. One thing is certain, if somebody should be jailed for ripping the piss out of Jesus, mass protest and civil disobediance, on a scale which would have the National Guard deployed in the US to contain it (much like we've seen over other regressive legislation here), will follow.
Actually, you may have heard of the satirical musical 'Jerry Springer', which was screened by the BBC, despite christian protest? This is the difference i'd like to highlight: in the UK, christians attempting to influence public policy are seen as precisely what they are, a lunatic fringe. Despite the fact that the Bible is still used to swear oaths on in a court of law, nobody actually thinks the Bible has any relevance to law, in fact hardly anybody thinks it has any relevance whatever, unless as an interesting work of historical significance.
Now, don't get me wrong, i'm not saying the UK rocks and the US stinks, because the 'stench of mendacity' is bloody powerful over here, it just seems to be worse wafting over the Atlantic. It's just that, little by little, we seem to be tackling it whilst you lot are voting it into The White House.
I'd draw your attention to the words of an American who is well respected in Europe, Lou Reed:
"Bring me your hungry, your homeless, your poor and I'll piss on them,
That's what the Statue of Bigotry says"
BTW, join the War Against Conservativism
It's a fact that the Church, in the UK, still is not disestablished, in fact we've recently had a law passed which makes it illegal to incite religious hatred per se, ostensibly to offer the same kind of protection available to all religions, this in the face of a campaign to simply repeal the Blasphemy laws, which previously protected only christianity. Being new law, it is yet to be seen how far the courts will allow satire to go, but many here see it as regressive. One thing is certain, if somebody should be jailed for ripping the piss out of Jesus, mass protest and civil disobediance, on a scale which would have the National Guard deployed in the US to contain it (much like we've seen over other regressive legislation here), will follow.
Actually, you may have heard of the satirical musical 'Jerry Springer', which was screened by the BBC, despite christian protest? This is the difference i'd like to highlight: in the UK, christians attempting to influence public policy are seen as precisely what they are, a lunatic fringe. Despite the fact that the Bible is still used to swear oaths on in a court of law, nobody actually thinks the Bible has any relevance to law, in fact hardly anybody thinks it has any relevance whatever, unless as an interesting work of historical significance.
Now, don't get me wrong, i'm not saying the UK rocks and the US stinks, because the 'stench of mendacity' is bloody powerful over here, it just seems to be worse wafting over the Atlantic. It's just that, little by little, we seem to be tackling it whilst you lot are voting it into The White House.
I'd draw your attention to the words of an American who is well respected in Europe, Lou Reed:
"Bring me your hungry, your homeless, your poor and I'll piss on them,
That's what the Statue of Bigotry says"
BTW, join the War Against Conservativism
Shades of the Velvet Underground! Never before in America has a President place his religion before his country, so we have had to make a bit of an adjustment.
In priciple, this nation's leader swears an oath to "defend the Constitution of the United States," but clearly this one does not consider our Bill of Rights (which restricts the actions of government) to be part of that document.
Obviously, and no doubt to the late Thomas Paine's great dismay, we have yet to reach The Age of Reason. To quote a personal favorite, it was Jerry Garcia who said: "What a long strange trip its been."
It was not long ago that the radical Right-wing reactionaries were considered "lunatics" here as well, now it seems to have gone mainstream. In the early twenties the German Nationalsozialist Party received two percent of the national vote. Within a little over a decade, the Third Reich was born.
Nationalism is a powerful, scary form of tribalism that lures zombie like followers and must be monitored constantly to avoid excess.
Mike G
In priciple, this nation's leader swears an oath to "defend the Constitution of the United States," but clearly this one does not consider our Bill of Rights (which restricts the actions of government) to be part of that document.
Obviously, and no doubt to the late Thomas Paine's great dismay, we have yet to reach The Age of Reason. To quote a personal favorite, it was Jerry Garcia who said: "What a long strange trip its been."
It was not long ago that the radical Right-wing reactionaries were considered "lunatics" here as well, now it seems to have gone mainstream. In the early twenties the German Nationalsozialist Party received two percent of the national vote. Within a little over a decade, the Third Reich was born.
Nationalism is a powerful, scary form of tribalism that lures zombie like followers and must be monitored constantly to avoid excess.
Mike G
Good man, yourself! (to quote some Irish mates)
Actually, the Lou Reed quote comes from his track 'Dirty Boulevard' off his solo album 'New York', obviously his voice was never his strong point and even though 'New York' was recorded yonks ago now, it is rough as a bear's arse, but well worth a listen. In fact, his throaty croaking just adds to the vibe, yaknow?
I am kind of heartened to think that the US is likely to be too close to bankruptcy to follow much further in Nazi footsteps, but then again, the latter managed to get massive loans (from The Vatican bank, i believe) which puts the Saudi - Bush connection in an even more sinister light.
Yes, i wonder if there has ever been an era that didn't "try men's souls?" The wierdest thing is that, in the UK, the monarch is the head of state and swears an oath to "Defend The Faith" but British citizens would be utterly horrified if they even attempted to do any such thing! Exactly the opposite of your situation... Jerry Garcia wasn't wrong, eh? In fairness, i think it's likely to get stranger...
Anyway, i hope you are well and bah humbug and all that, ex
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Actually, the Lou Reed quote comes from his track 'Dirty Boulevard' off his solo album 'New York', obviously his voice was never his strong point and even though 'New York' was recorded yonks ago now, it is rough as a bear's arse, but well worth a listen. In fact, his throaty croaking just adds to the vibe, yaknow?
I am kind of heartened to think that the US is likely to be too close to bankruptcy to follow much further in Nazi footsteps, but then again, the latter managed to get massive loans (from The Vatican bank, i believe) which puts the Saudi - Bush connection in an even more sinister light.
Yes, i wonder if there has ever been an era that didn't "try men's souls?" The wierdest thing is that, in the UK, the monarch is the head of state and swears an oath to "Defend The Faith" but British citizens would be utterly horrified if they even attempted to do any such thing! Exactly the opposite of your situation... Jerry Garcia wasn't wrong, eh? In fairness, i think it's likely to get stranger...
Anyway, i hope you are well and bah humbug and all that, ex
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